Dr Claudia Sheftel-Luiz: From Freudian Psychoanalysis to Modern Psychoanalysis
Let’s start from the beginning, Claudia! I read your mother started with her journey in psychoanalysis, and then you grew yourself into this tradition. Could you tell us about how your journey in this field began? Well, my mother’s father was from Argentina & he was very, very disturbed. In fact, he died in a mental institution. He suffered from severe bipolar disorder, including violent manic episodes. But she was able to leave South America and study music with their assistance. Although she was able to escape the disease, she was understandably numb. And she went to Italy with my father, who was also a refugee from Russia. There was a lot of trauma and some mental illness on that end as well. And they reasoned that if they remained away from us, they would shield me and my sister from the illness. They went on tours because they were musicians, and we were raised by nannies. They thought that if they called us, we would sob. So they didn’t call us. My sister and I were a mess by the time we were eight or nine. As Galit Atlas would say, we had inherited some of the ’emotional inheritance’. We also had new trauma from our carers. As a result, my mum realized she needed to do something to help us. She brought us to America and found us these fantastic psychoanalysts. It was only luck and destiny that led her to the psychoanalyst, and the entire family changed. We were living together. We started to talk. We had a completely different family dynamic, and by the age of 16, I knew this was the path I wanted to take. Meanwhile, my mother, who had been a musician and subsequently an interpreter at the United Nations, began studying it. She really wanted to understand me and my sister. She wanted to understand mental illness. She wanted to understand what creates healing. She wrote her dissertation on us and she turned the family history around. So I’ve been in the psychoanalytic world because she ascended through the ranks–I was there as a child–and in the entire milieu of this New York modern psychoanalysis. I was able to witness a few generations and what happens when you have an emotional inheritance. (I adore this word, instead of mental disease, which is so dreadful). So, when there are emotional inheritances, it takes several generations to change the DNA, since the first generation must change their actions. But the second generation is still experiencing the feelings and trying to find a vocabulary for the distortions, cognitive disorders, mood disorders, impulse disorders, or whatever you’ve inherited. And then when you raise your own children, it’s really not until the third generation that you see freedom. True freedom- from the disorders where there is mentation right out of the gate, ego strength right out of the gate, trust, and resilience right out of the gate. So I consider myself extremely fortunate to be a second-generation analyst in a system capable of studying intergenerational processes. I think you’re putting it so poignantly that psychoanalysis is not just healing you and healing your traumas, but how it is also so powerful that it can change generations and what we call the trans-generational trauma. That’s really how longitudinally it can also work. I believe that with an inherited trauma, particularly thought disorders, which are the most severe, you can expect to see a lot of improvement in a 30-year analysis and the ability to develop some mind, but you will not see that person who can function in the world, get married, and work. So the psychoanalytic work is one of generational healing. This also takes me back to when I was reading about you, that there is something really authentic in you. (Once again, that is the term that springs to me whenever I view your work, including your book).It’s a very genuine work, in my opinion. It’s written in terms of your own cases and how you’ve fallen and failed, and how you’ve recognised and welled with your patients. I believe it’s such an authentic, permeable expression. Yeah. I love that you’ve observed that because it’s crucial to the training. Nothing was off the table when I was training to be a psychoanalyst. You researched yourself and your peers. Everything was discussed. The line between personal and private was fairly thin. We used ourselves as clinical examples and worked with our own countertransference and character. So I learned to be clinical, and that helps a lot with the shame that comes with being disordered. It’s very painful to be disordered. And when you start to realize in a sense that you are crazy, that your mind is playing tricks on you because we all know that we hurt, but we don’t yet know how we defend; we can’t see our defences until very late. And seeing that fills us with shame. So being able to be clinical about oneself definitely helps with that embarrassment. And I believe this is what you’re getting from me, which I love because it really helps you become a good analyst, is being able to be clinical about your own life. So you feel this, this authenticity, which is sometimes also confused with self-disclosure in the psychoanalytic realm is actually helpful… I believe so because, with patients, everyone comes in regressive, and it’s really not about you as a person, it’s about them. And something happens in a different dimension that has nothing to do with the manifest content, or with the actual conversation. That’s that evenly hovering attention that a patient can feel if you are with them. Yeah, sure. I’m just thinking about the ethics or training that has been instilled in us… This concept of how much we disclose, and how honestly and eloquently you put out your life history, I’m sure your patients are aware of it as well. Do you think it gets in your





